Where do you fall politically?

I’m hoping this doesn’t start a fight, I’m just curious what the political orientation is of this community. I grew up in a liberal (in the American sense) family, and I identify now as a socialist, though a lot of the liberalism I grew up in has stuck with me, like interest in LGBTQ and women’s rights, environmentalism, etc. Wondering where people here land?

oscardejarjayes,

I’m an anarchist, and very much into industrial unions.

Catradora_Stalinism,

anarcho syndicalist?

oscardejarjayes,

That would probably be an accurate description of me, but I think simply “Anarchist” has wider implications. I do more than unions and I think eco-anarchism and popular assemblies might possibly be a more effective path towards the eradication of unjust hierarchies.

Grownbravy,
@Grownbravy@hexbear.net avatar

Some form of militant communist.

culpritus,
@culpritus@hexbear.net avatar

Centrist communist. I think MLs and Anarchists have useful ideas about making the world better. I’m leaning more ML lately mostly due to learning about the oppressive history of western capitalist interests, and how pacifist approaches have repeatedly failed to survive.

HornyOnMain,

im a centrist, not too far left (mao-wave) and not too far right (deng-smile), just in the moderate centre (xi-clap)

CommieGabredabok,
@CommieGabredabok@hexbear.net avatar

Also centrist, not too far left ( bordiga-despair) and not too far right ( chad-trotsky) , just in the moderate centre ( stalin)

ProxyTheAwesome,

TBF to old trot, idk if he’s ultra left or a right deviationist because he was such an opportunist that he fluctuated on which side of the opposition he worked with. He just went with whatever side had more leverage opposing Stalin that day.

CommieGabredabok,
@CommieGabredabok@hexbear.net avatar

true dat. Trot is definitely not an ultra left, and you are correct on his opportunism fluctuating on whatever would oppose Stalin – to the point of supporting terrorism

IceWallowCum,
@IceWallowCum@hexbear.net avatar

Yeah, I think some form of Anarchisms are the more-than-long goal for many places, but the early stages, with capitalists fighting to keep power, definately still need strong and organized defense forces, and a state is probably the best way of doing that.

The overabundance of essential resources that communism aims at will probably allow for groups of all sizes to organize as they wish/need

duderium,

ML, death to amerikkka

CantaloupeAss,

I am mostly a Maoist, with some anarchism sprinkled in.

Basically I think the single fastest thing we could to do improve our society is to:

  1. all kill our landlords
  2. form community mutual aid networks in the homes we subsequently inhabit without fear, while
  3. putting a priority on decolonisation and welcoming of displaced peoples to their imperialized lands.
startrekexplained,

How do you feel on the Nepalese Maoists?

CantaloupeAss,

This might not be the most satisfying answer, but my opinions of Maoism are based on what I’ve read of his principal texts and of the economic and social revitalization of China since he was in power. I live in the imperial core, and when I look around at the societal problems in my community and in my country writ large, I see immediate land redistribution as the swiftest cure to the largest issue, and Mao in my mind is the foremost advocate, architect, and practitioner of anticapitalist land redistribution on the national scale.

So my view is mostly from old books and from my neighborhood, and I’m not too well versed with the other cells around the world who claim the Maoist title. All I’ll say about the Nepalese Maoists is, my knee-jerk reaction to anticapitalist forces is support, I don’t know enough about them to comment further, and I hesitate to levy judgment on people across the world from me.

startrekexplained,

Fair enough, was specifically wondering what your views were on People’s Multiparty Democracy that Nepalese Maoists subscribe to?

JuneFall,

en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_communist_parties_in_N…

Nepal’s communist and “communist” parties are a very complex and complicated topic.

Anticorp,

My liberal friends call me a libertarian, and my conservative friends call me a libtard. So what does that make me? A centrist? I don’t believe fully in any one ideology. There are good things about multiple different belief systems, and bad things about them too. I think we’re doing ourselves a massive disservice by aligning so neatly into tribalistic views of the world.

startrekexplained,

Agreed with that

UlyssesT,

https://hexbear.net/pictrs/image/de0507e8-3ce7-40a6-a785-901e8ea04450.png

Maoo,
@Maoo@hexbear.net avatar

Most Americans (your terminology is American so I’m assuming) have incoherent political beliefs handed down to them by popular discourse. Nearly all of them can be summarized as liberalism, i.e. a supporter of the capitalist order, and “debate” is whittled down to which of its various forms you “support”. You are given basically zero agency to actually support those things unless you’re a major business influence, but your frustrations at a lack of material improvement in your and others’ lives has been effectively redirected into a pantomime of political movements, and this helps the boss pick your pocket.

Basically… this is how I would contextualize conservatives (liberals) and liberals (liberals) calling you “the other”. You probably just aren’t subscribing to their own team sport-like political divide, one that changes easily and often depending on what their masters tell them to think. That doesn’t necessarily make your understanding better or worse, I just want to point out that their opinions probably mean nothing and that you are probably a fairly typical person in your region.

With that said, I highly recommend reading about the foundations of socialism and the horrible things the US has done and continues to do to other countries to enforce its economic order. We are not taught these things in school - we are instead taught nationalism and arguably fascist things so that there are ready-made excuses for the terrorism our country inflicts on others and us. There are, unfortunately, many, many examples, but one place to start is the coup and genocidal campaign in Guatemala premised in bailing out the exploitative landlords (basically feudal lords) there in the form of fruit companies. Their truth and reconciliation document is one of pure horror. The School of the Americas never died, it just expanded and became more diffuse. This is the ideology of mainstream America.

rebul,

I would like to be King.

Silverseren,

Rather far left both economically and socially, but I actually understand that progress takes step by step effort and screaming that you want everything done now doesn't get you anywhere. Also, purity tests of "follow every one of my beliefs or you're evil" are dumb and unhelpful when you're discussing where people are on the left.

Oh, and I think tankies are morons.

startrekexplained,

Tankies are the bane of my existence, so I agree

CommieGabredabok,
@CommieGabredabok@hexbear.net avatar

fiscally Marxist-Leninist (le ebil tankie)

socially anarchist

startrekexplained,

I’m interested what you mean by this? Fiscally for a command economy but socially against it?

CommieGabredabok,
@CommieGabredabok@hexbear.net avatar

It’s kind of a joke how liberals say “they are socially progressive but fiscally conservative,” while the whole definition of liberalism in the Amerikan States is messed up.

But it’s also not a joke in the sense that there are two wolves inside me: le puritan Leninist that is primarily concerned with (redacted) and people’s war. and bisexual femboy

startrekexplained,

I never understood LGBTQ people who identify as Leninists or ML given these regimes heavily persecuted LGBTQ people and continue to persecute them to this day (China for example)

CommieGabredabok,
@CommieGabredabok@hexbear.net avatar

You can check out the new Cuba family code. It was heavily discussed and amended at the lower councils and then passed through to the national level. Also, Fidel did have some conservative beliefs regarding gay people in the past, but he later took back what he said and supported LGBTQ+. The DDR was also wildly progressive on the gender, sexuality, and feminist front. I have heard that the DPRK is slightly culturally conservative in the aspect that public displays of affection are generally frowned upon, but LGBTQ+ are not persecuted, but neither outright celebrated. Similar position to China and Vietnam.

The takeaway for LGBTQ+ rights is not corporate sponsors, pride parades, and consumption – but if they are free to be themselves. Are they committing sewerslide in droves? Being targeted by death squads? In many parts of the West, many of their rights are being rolled back or threatened, especially in Amerika. Not all AES support for LGBTQ+ community is perfect, but that would be due to the limiting factor of traditional, conservative views held by the majority population – not socialism.

startrekexplained,

I’m aware of Cuba’s recent laws regarding LGBTQ rights. Cuba for decades sent homosexuals and trans people into internment camps because they were “deviants” and only recently has enacted LGBTQ rights because it’s been forced to open up to the rest of the world after the fall of the Soviet Union. Also it’s just one example, whereas the largest ML country, China, heavily represses anyone who is not heteronormative. So does North Korea. So did the Soviet Union and Eastern Bloc. It was in liberal democracies where LGBTQ people first gained rights and have the strongest rights.

CommieGabredabok, (edited )
@CommieGabredabok@hexbear.net avatar

https://www.guancha.cn/politics/2019_08_21_514563.shtml

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-lgbt-un/china-urged-to-take-action-on-lgbt-rights-after-backing-u-n-changes-idUSKCN1QO1MU

https://baike.baidu.com/item/%E6%80%A7%E5%B0%91%E6%95%B0%E7%BE%A4%E4%BD%93/19500488

https://issuu.com/undp-china/docs/undp-ch-legal_gender_recognition_-_

Homosexuality in China and Does China Ban the LGBT movement?

China has trans healthcare. You can find LGBTQ stuff on Bilibili or Baidu. China has a three-no policy. No approval. No disapproval. No promotion. As for you – no investigation, no right to speak.

As for Soviet Union and Eastern Bloc goes…

Article 121 (the “anti-gay law” passed by the head soviet) was designed as an anti-pederasty law. If you look at the law text,it mentions or at least implies pedophilia.

To quote The Sangha kommune:

“Article 121, despite its curious reading, appears to have been designed to protect Soviet society from the menace of child abuse and paedophilia, although it is recorded that Soviet academia was interested in the practice of homosexuality from a medical perspective, and attempting to ascertain its root cause (with a number of early Soviet researchers following the Czarist assumption of aberration). This did not mean that homosexuals were persecuted – far from it – the general underlying trend in the USSR was to end all oppression, and facilitate the integration of the individual into the collective.”

https://thesanghakommune.org/2016/12/28/the-ussr-and-homosexuality-article-21/ There’s no objective, verifiable evidence of a persecution of homosexuals in the USSR

To quote Sangha Kommune again:

Research By Adrian Chan-Wyles PhD

"The fact that the Soviet Union was considered enlightened and tolerant demonstrates that these laws were not applied as a deliberate attack upon homosexuals – although in the 1930’s, certain homosexual activity became associated with specific counter-revolutionary activity. In this regard, homosexuals who strove to bring-down the USSR were treated as ‘criminals’ – just as their heterosexual colleagues. Soviet records demonstrate that Joseph Stalin… was responding to various police reports about contemporary counter-revolutionary activities (usually within major cities). "

"Modern (capitalist) Russia has now imported much of the anti-Soviet Cold War disinformation fabricated by the US (and her allies) between 1945 – 1991. As a result, many modern Russian authors side with the reactionary forces of capitalism and adopt this pseudo-history as their own (apparently not realising its ‘racist’ anti-Slavic nature). The above article is anti-Soviet and is designed to give the impression that the USSR carried-out a continued pogrom against homosexuals – even though its author continuously states that there is no evidence to support his claims. Indeed, the only evidence the author can muster is ‘Western’ Cold War authors whose work – as pieces of official fiction – contain no Russian language sources. However, I have quoted this piece where I have been able to verify the facts within Russian language sources. It remains informative on two counts, 1) as a narrative history of homosexuality in Russia from early times to present, and 2) as a study of modern (Russian) anti-Soviet literature. I have found no objective, verifiable evidence of a deliberate persecution of homosexuals in the USSR. "

https://thesanghakommune.org/2017/01/05/the-ussr-and-homosexuality-part-iii-rsfsr-article-154a/

LGBTQ+ being put into camps in Cuba is also straight-up an anti-communist myth.

To say that “It was in liberal democracies where LGBTQ people first gained rights and have the strongest rights.” is ridiculous. AES countries had LGBTQ+ rights first and continued progressing, The DDR was fairly progressive in the 1980s and continued to progress – similar to the USSR and Eastern Bloc, however, I discussed the famous article 121 above how ""homosexuality was recriminalized. Meanwhile, during the Red Scare in Amerika, gays were specifically investigated because they were seen as more likely to be communists. In many parts of the West, it took until the late 20th and early 21st centuries for the advancement of rights for the LGBTQ+ community.

startrekexplained, (edited )

economist.com/…/why-the-communist-party-fears-gay…

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_history_in_Russia#Sovi…

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Cuba#Homopho…

So no, reality doesn’t conform to what you’re saying.

DDR was fairly progressive in the 1980s

It was less progressive than West Germany/West Berlin, and only began tolerating LGBTQ people (not granting them equal rights) after opening up more to the West near the end of its existence.

en.wikipedia.org/…/LGBT_rights_in_the_German_Demo…

CommieGabredabok,
@CommieGabredabok@hexbear.net avatar

Sources: LE FUCKIN ECONOMIST – “journal that speaks for British billionaires.” It’s just more anti-China absurd nonsense. AT LEAST TAKE A LOOK AT MY BAIDU LINK WHICH IS LITERALLY WRITTEN BY A PERSON LIVING IN CHINA. It summarizes things nicely, and you could just translate it.

do some more digging than just wiki.

the sources that wiki links for its claims are: " #37Archive from Resource Information Center Washington D.C in 1998. Their claim of punishment for sodomy and homosexual relationships being 5 years of hard labor was States News Service 28 May 1991; The San Francisco Chronicle 18 Oct. 1992. I found the San Francisco Chronicle newspaper article, but it was paywalled, so I will have to see if my local library has it, or if I can get access to it.

Then the book “Hidden from history: reclaiming the gay and lesbian past” from pages 347-364 “Russia’s gay literature and culture :the impact of the October revolution” by Simon Karlinsky – gay scholar of Russian literature at Berkley. He often contends that the “Marxist Leninist ideology is at odds with homosexuality.” Why does he contend that? Good question. He says the ideology goes against homosexuality. Which is weird, because he isn’t arguing about real world socialism, but the ideology, which is synthesized from many socialist authors/works/theories but isn’t inheritly anti-homosexual

The actual wiki states " there were several high-profile arrests of Russian men accused of being pederasts. In 1933, 130 men “were accused of being ‘pederasts’ – adult males who have sex with boys. Since no records of men having sex with boys at that time are available, it is possible this term was used broadly and crudely to label homosexuality”

And I am getting a 404 to the 43rd resource

The book “Homosexual Desire in Revolutionary Russia: The Regulation of Sexual and Gender Dissent” by Dan Healy is referenced a lot. He actually is pro lenin, (and trotsky?), but very anti-Stalin, and uses a lot of primary sources/narratives about sexuality in the USSR.

" “In the first criminal code they composed after the revolution (1922), the Bolsheviks decriminalized sodomy. They did so because they were intent on secularizing and medicalizing the language of sexual crime. Old Testament concepts like “sodomy,” “fornication,” and “feminine honor” were purged from the law. In their place came a modernized, gender-neutral language to describe a sexual revolution. Henceforth, the sexual inviolability of all young persons was to be protected by the state, and the maximum self-determination was offered to both adult men and women: freedom to marry and divorce without having to explain why, freedom to engage in harmless consensual sexual relations without the interference of a moralizing higher authority. Homosexual relations were not explicitly welcomed by the Bolsheviks and raised to an equal status with heterosexuality. Yet they were regarded in principle as no great vice. The majority of Bolsheviks perhaps subscribed to the view that homosexuality was a medical condition, probably (if they read the popular sex advice tracts that they sponsored) a hormonal anomaly, and perhaps one day science would be able to control or even eradicate it. In the meantime, the legal persecution of homosexuals found in Britain and Germany was seen as irrational, reactionary, and bourgeois.” — Daniel D Hailey

and from the wiki ITSELF!!

“Soviet legislation does not recognise so-called crimes against morality. Our laws proceed from the principle of protection of society and therefore countenance punishment only in those instances when juveniles and minors are the objects of homosexual interest (emphasis mine, because that is literally what I was fucking saying)”

—Sereisky, Great Soviet Encyclopedia, 1930, p. 593

DO YOU NOT READ? Even from le ant-commie wiki. 5 short paragraphs are all for “Stalin era”

and again, this is in THE FUCKING 1930s. THE BASTION OF “LIBERAL DEMOCRACY” IN AMERIKKKA IS LYNCHING BLACK PEOPLE

Also, the thing about Cuba is again, a myth. I am not going into that. But you can’t use WIKI AS A SOURCE. They are a compilation of sources. Can give a good run-down on things. Generally bad for political stuff. And there is a lot more shit I wanna say but I have to go to work very soon.

ALSO YOUR FUCKING NONSENSE ABOUT THE DDR IS STRAIGHT-UP INCORRECT. LIKE ACTUALLY STUPID. LIKE THE MOST STUPID THING I HAVE HEARD ALL DAY. AFTER HEARING THAT, I AM ENDING THIS CONVERSATION.

I am going to touch le grass. not bother replying to Kautsky

beautiful_boater,
@beautiful_boater@hexbear.net avatar

Even the wikipedia article on LGBT rights in Germany, despite being very slanted and anti-communist, admit that West Germany had no national progress in gay rights until after the cold war. Saying the West/West Germany was more progressive and tolerant is just straight up false.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Germany

BeamBrain,
@BeamBrain@hexbear.net avatar

The US didn’t decriminalize homosexuality until 2003, decades after most of the Eastern Bloc. You’re kidding yourself.

AcidSmiley,
@AcidSmiley@hexbear.net avatar

PIGPOOPBALLS

zkrzsz,

Wikipedia links got thrown around like it’s the absolute truth source, people would frown upon Wikipedia link back then and linking them is more of a reference. For sensitive topic like politic, people should praise a big doubt if it’s from Wikipedia.

Furthermore, linking and not even quoting relevant points is just lazy and low effort.

Kuori,
@Kuori@hexbear.net avatar

It was in liberal democracies where LGBTQ people first gained rights and have the strongest rights.

hi i’m trans and i live in florida, where are my human rights you dickhead? where are your precious liberals?

startrekexplained, (edited )

They’re not in communist countries. And Florida is led by illiberal increasingly anti-democratic figures that are directly inspired by Russia and even China, so what a terrible example to counteract my point, lol

CommieGabredabok,
@CommieGabredabok@hexbear.net avatar

“inspired by Russia and even China”

dawg what.

startrekexplained,

The GOP is directly inspired by the homophobic attitudes in both countries. Have you been living under a rock?

raven,

Conservatives have been homophobic and racist since there has been a conservative. “Actually China did that”

CommieGabredabok,
@CommieGabredabok@hexbear.net avatar

“here is why it is China’s fault for Amerika being rascist”

BeamBrain,
@BeamBrain@hexbear.net avatar

Love to accuse communists of being intolerant and socially conservative while engaging in Yellow Perilism and saying that America’s problems are the fault of evil inferior foreigners

Ram_The_Manparts,
@Ram_The_Manparts@hexbear.net avatar

You don’t even believe this yourself.

There is absolutely no way that you don’t understand that the GOP’s anti-queer stance is 100% homegrown, and you’re only making this ridiculous argument because you’re incapable of admitting that your previous comments on this topic are all bullshit.

Do better and just take the L, this isn’t fucking reddit.

CyborgMarx,

The GOP is directly inspired by the homophobic attitudes in both countries

lmao are you doing a shitty bit, what absolute fuckin nonsense, absolving western homophobes of responsibility and agency while simultaneously peddling a racist conspiracy theory, get a grip you shitlib

CrispyFern,
@CrispyFern@hexbear.net avatar

" Americas problems are caused by foreigners"

Scratch a liberal, a fascist bleeds. hitler-detector

ProxyTheAwesome,

AmeriKKKans are incapable of realizing the evil is coming from inside the house

RedDawn,
@RedDawn@hexbear.net avatar

You’re just straight up lying about Cuba, shut the fuck up.

Kuori,
@Kuori@hexbear.net avatar

i never understood LGBTQ people who identify as liberals given these regimes heavily persecuted LGBTQ people and continue to persecute them to this day (the U.S. for example)

startrekexplained,

Yeah it’s not like the countries with the highest acceptance and rights of lgbtq people are liberal democracies, lol

sharedburdens,

I have a lot of thoughts about this as a trans person, and a communist. For one I strongly dislike the way liberals try to use queer people to excuse their war machine - it just gives the cover for bigots abroad to veil their misogyny and transphobia as “anti-imperialism”

Liberals are not doing queer people a service by making them the political football. You’re not helping queer people in the countries you sanction and lay waste to either. Stonewall was a riot. If you’re poor, queer people have not been really “accepted” in places like the US until relatively recently- it took 9 unelected people in robes to allow gay marriage, and Obama “evolved” on it.

As a trans person, the outcome that would directly benefit me the most from political action would be the immediate abolition of private property - ie decommodifying housing, and guaranteeing healthcare- nationalizing the for-profit healthcare. It’s no good to me that my rights are “accepted” in the west if I can’t afford to fucking transition and I’m living on the street. But I guess that would be “authoritarian”

startrekexplained,

As a trans person, the outcome that would directly benefit me the most from political action would be the immediate abolition of private property

No it wouldn’t, given they didn’t have rights in the Soviet Union, which abolished private property.

I don’t really buy into tankies complaining about “the war machine” when they back Russian and Chinese imperialism. Something tells me you don’t care about trans rights when Russia directly claims to be fighting LGBTQ people in Ukraine.

sharedburdens, (edited )

If my options are 1. unsafe living situations at home 2. unsafe living situations in shelters 3. unsafe living situations on the street + police encounters, a khrushchyovka sounds pretty fucking good.

What good are rights when you’re poor and hungry with no fucking housing?

edit- NATO has couped/overthrown a lot of governments before Ukraine.

CW: SA

spoilerIn Greece during the coup "the US ambassador in Athens, Phillips Talbot, complained to Maury ((Athens CIA chief) one week after the brutal change of power that the US coup represented ‘a rape of democracy’. Maury answered: 'How can you rape a whore? https://hexbear.net/pictrs/image/0859d75f-3156-48d5-b834-65153a8296cf.png

startrekexplained,

What good are rights when you’re poor and hungry with no fucking housing?

I mean you’re not poor and hungry if you have time to argue with me on Lemmy on a Star Trek space, unless you just have really bad priorities? Also you dodged the point about private property abolition not doing anything for trans rights…

sharedburdens,

I’m on hexbear, and I didn’t dodge the point you just didn’t make one worth addressing xaxa.

Having stable housing makes a big fucking difference to even being able to transition. Speaking from experience.

startrekexplained,

Yeah you dodged it because you have no response.

sharedburdens,

I literally just addressed that though, maybe try reading with that big ol brain of yours.

AcidSmiley,
@AcidSmiley@hexbear.net avatar

Shut the fuck up you dumb cis shit. You’re telling trans people that we don’t care about our persecution in Russia. You are lecturing us about our legal and economic situation without understanding ANYTHING about the problems we face. Fuck you. Fuck you. Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.Fuck you. Fuck you.

Grownbravy,
@Grownbravy@hexbear.net avatar

It’s something that often people will point to how communists heavily persecute LGBTQ people but ignore that the people who fought for LGBTQ liberation in the western world were Marxists, MLs, Maoists, or worked very closely with those groups.

AcidSmiley,
@AcidSmiley@hexbear.net avatar

Do not fucking dare to speak for us with your ahistoric ideas about gay rights. No communist government during the 20th century was worse than western countries on “equal rights” for LGBTQIA+ people. Because we didn’t have equal rights anywhere in the world in the last century. Are you a literal fucking child that you’re unaware of that or are you just the typical liberal that completely lacks object permanence and immediately forgets how he has actively supported the oppression of marginalized people once the mainstream consensus has moved on? That doesn’t mean the USSR’s treatment of gay people wasn’t atrocious, it means that we were legally persecuted everywhere. The USSR threw gay people in jail, so did the USA and West Germany and the UK. Gay men were actively hunted by the law in the bourgeoise democracies you love so much. Germany had forced sterilization of trans people seeking a name change until 2011 (btw the DDR didn’t have a law like that on the books). Fuck you for thinking us having at least some basic human rights has always been the status quo of the enlightened west since forever, i still have to struggle against my goverment and my healthcare system all the damn time while my people are being actively singled out and villified through multimillion euro harassment campaigns backed by our conservative party. How do you fucking dare to explain to me how free i am under this joke of a system? Democracy is a fucking nightmare when you’re a minority of less than 1% of the population. Majority rule means minorities are treated like dirt. Free speech means that the majority is free to shout us down while we are being silenced.

Regarding your idiot takes on the DDR, backed by wikiepdia links (lol) that you, in typical liberal fashion, didn’t even read, the “equal rights” situation was actually better in the DDR, were gay sex was legalized in 1968 instead of 1994 like in the West, which only had a partial legalization a year after the DDR and retained a significantly higher age of consent for gay relationships, as judges and lawmakers back then were firmly convinced the being gay spread by social contagion and that vulnerable young men had to be protected from predatory queers trying to turn them gay. That was the actual legal consensus about gay sex throughout the mid 20th century in Germany. If you knew ANYTHING about gay rights in Germany, you’d be aware of this, it’s a key part of queer German history how the West perpetuated fascist views about queerness. West German conservatives were thinking out loud about throwing gay people in camps in the 1980s. But you aren’t, because you’re a clueless het shit trying to straightsplain queer rights to queer people.

Ram_The_Manparts,
@Ram_The_Manparts@hexbear.net avatar

10/10, no notes.

SpookyGenderCommunist,
@SpookyGenderCommunist@hexbear.net avatar
  1. The Queer liberation movement has long been spearheaded by communists. Harry Hay, Sylvia Rivera, Rudolf Klimmer, and many others, were all communists who, in some form or another pushed forward the cause of queer liberation.
  2. On the whole, Socialist states in the 20th century were no better or worse on queer issues than any liberal democracy. We were treated like shit pretty much everywhere. They were not special in this regard.
  3. A notable exception was East Germany, which, though not without flaws, had a far better queer rights track record than its Western capitalist counterpart:

The HIB (Homosexuelle Interessengemeinschaft Berlin) was established in 1973 with the belief that ‘homosexual emancipation is part of the success of socialism’.

  1. Modern ML states like Cuba have made immense strides in queer rights in the modern day, and progress in, for instance, China is slow but steady.
DarkenLM,

Anarchism. Not the radical burn-the-world-to-ashes kind but rather the kind where power is given to the individuals as a whole and every one of them directly decides how society is shaped. A society with no authority that can turn to tyranny and where everyone's needs are satisfied and everyone contributes on the field they are best on (to each according to their needs, from each according to their ability).

startrekexplained,

So a direct democracy?

DarkenLM,

WIth some differences, but yes.

startrekexplained, (edited )

Just asking for clarification. I’m not for direct democracy because it seems like democracy just for the elite.

DarkenLM,

According to the school of thought I follow, every individual on a society has a direct say on everything discussed. Rules, or laws, are defined through a consensus between every individual. If a single individual disagrees, provided they present valid arguments, then the rule must be expanded in a way everyone agrees with it.

On this society, everyone's basic needs are a core right that cannot be taken or restricted in any way, shape or form. That includes, but not restricted to, proper housing, including electricity and Internet, food and water infrastructure, education and healthcare. That explains the "to each according to their needs" part partially.
Having their needs, therefore their survival ensured, individuals can dedicate themselves to the field they prefer, ensuring no-one is stuck on a job they hate, they can at any point change, and society as a whole benefits from this liberty. Of course there are some fields that individuals with some kinds of disabilities physically cannot work on normally, but there can be jobs that are adapted to their condition, if possible. That covers the "from each according to their ability".

Those two statements allow for an economical reform. The basic needs of an individual are fulfilled from the get-go, but if they desire some other commodities, they can work for them. Money, if needed at all, would only be needed for those commodities, while favoring trading between individuals. Again, society as a whole would determine how much a product would be worth comparatively to others, creating something more akin to a measuring scale of worth rather than a currency.

startrekexplained,

I don’t think you can have a direct say in everything in society, trying to make such a society sounds like a nightmare IMO.

VelvetStorm,

I am very heavy left leaning. I want adults to be able to marry as many other consenting adults as they want(yes I mean a poly liftstyle). I want trans people to have rights and I want women to have full reproductive rights. I want free Healthcare for all as well as some sort of free food and water if needed and free basic clothing and housing if needed. And honestly I want us to start killing nazis again.

startrekexplained,

Killing nazis, like the government executing people who identify as neo-nazis?

dilithium_dame,

I call myself a New Deal democrat.

M68040, (edited )
@M68040@hexbear.net avatar

Theoretically some kind of communist but it’s mostly just all window dressing for whatever lets me act out my decades long grudge against conservatism at large. The fact that I hate their asses and want to spend the rest of my life lashing out at them is more where my commitments lie more so than any specific school of thought

WoofWoof91,
@WoofWoof91@hexbear.net avatar

i will answer this question through the medium of image

https://hexbear.net/pictrs/image/242f0b05-e20c-44ed-a148-166c6332f5fe.webp

startrekexplained,

So a tankie?

WoofWoof91,
@WoofWoof91@hexbear.net avatar

да, товарищ

Gsus4,
@Gsus4@feddit.nl avatar

https://feddit.nl/pictrs/image/09c5c3eb-8774-4293-9818-6dab8845b2fa.jpeg remember when the Soviets had a military parade with the Nazis? Pepperidge farm remembers. …wikipedia.org/…/German–Soviet_military_parade_in…

Blamemeta,

I’m right wing, or at least compared to most of lemmy.

I want everyone to bear arms. To that end, we should air drop liberator-style pistols all over the world. No, I’m not joking.

I think America should put America first.

I think Trek is cool, but its also fiction and not some sort of practical political ideal.

I think we need common sense immigration laws, which would mean going after coyotes and businesses that hire illegals and abuse visa workers. We’ll be fine if our population was stagnant for a bit.

I think (in regards to lgbt) that you can do whatever you want between consenting adults, but leave kids out of it. Lot of upset about elementary school libraries and drag in schools, especially for a group that has nothing to do with kids.

I think we need better mental health, but I have no idea how that would look practically.

The internet was an inevitable mistake.

Anime was an avoidable mistake. Darkness best waifu.

Leftism feels like a cult these days. I don’t know why or how to describe it, but it does.

I think large international corporations need to be heavily regulated. At a certain size, maybe even making them utilities. Small companies should have more leeway.

There are problems, but they can be solved without burning down the system.

startrekexplained,

So you are one of those types against drag story hour?

Also you want a stagnant population and prefer that over immigration?

Spot,
@Spot@startrek.website avatar

I don’t get how bible story times is any better that drag queen story times, if the interest of the children’s well being is real. I was raised in the christian church and feel very much like I was groomed and indoctrinated as I was brought up.

startrekexplained,

Drag queens just reading nice kids books to children is better than indoctrinating kids into Christianity, IMO

uniqueid198x,

CBO projects that the majority of population growth overthe next two decades is from immigration. It seems our friend here is in favor of a shrinking population

www.cbo.gov/publication/58612

Blamemeta,

I am. Or at least slowing growth. I’d prefer stopping or shrinking, but I figure slowing is an easier sell.

startrekexplained,

Yeah that confused me, because a shrinking population is bad for the economy, no?

Blamemeta,

Yes, we cant grow forever. Better long term solution is for other countries to become livable.

startrekexplained,

But immigration is an excellent solution to declining birth rates, why be against that?

Blamemeta,

I don’t view declining birth rates as a problem.

startrekexplained,

It’s economic suicide but okay.

JesseoftheNorth,

That’s a lot of words to say you are an ignorant racist.

Chetzemoka,

You’re full of shit, just based on prior comments.

Common sense immigration, leaving what’s done with consenting adults alone, these things do not track with what you’re usually saying around here. Just saying

If “leftism” (what the fuck does that even mean?) feels like a cult, you’re getting your information from places that are busy making mountains out of molehills because of the money they get by keeping you outraged so they can keep your attention. “Some random weirdos on Twitter posted some crazy shit” has nothing to do with actual policies being actually enacted.

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